LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library


LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#1
Hi folks,

the LDraw Steering Committee agreed to allow digital parts of third parties in the LDraw Parts Library, which have a counterpart in the real world and are accepted by the LEGO fan community. Such parts are branded as:

* Third party - <part name>

and have to go through the LDraw Parts Tracker for certification. Potential candidates for such parts are for example:

http://www.bigbenbricks.com/
https://www.sbrick.com/

Willy Tschager
on behalf of the LDraw Steering Committee
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#2
Hi,

I was asked if third party means also MB or any on the Communist LEGO list? Just let me clear that we do not open to clones but to bricks manufactured by third parties, who's bricks you might see on AFOL conventions and the builder using those didn't get banned immediately :-)

Furthermore we do not except custom bricks which either exist only in the digital world or do not have a widespread use such as bricks from a 3D printer used by you and your LUG.

Willy Tschager
on behalf of the LDraw Steering Committee
LEGO ergo sum
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#3
This wasn't supposed to be a 1st of April fool?
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#4
(2016-10-14, 7:11)Damien Roux Wrote: This wasn't supposed to be a 1st of April fool?

Nope, it wasn't supposed as April fool. It's real. Big Grin

/Max
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#5
I though you were talking about that.
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#16
(2016-10-14, 5:38)Willy Tschager Wrote: Hi,

I was asked if third party means also MB or any on the Communist LEGO list? Just let me clear that we do not open to clones but to bricks manufactured by third parties, who's bricks you might see on AFOL conventions and the builder using those didn't get banned immediately.

That wasn't very clear at all IMO. What makes some parts or brands third party and others clones? Country of origin? Or do the trird parties pay some kind of licence fee to TLG, as opposed to the Chinese? Acceptance on AFOL conventions? As if AFOL conventions is the only measurement of LEGO Canon and Apocrypha, and the voices of vast majority of LEGO fans who cannot afford to attend those conventions don't count? Even if Chinese "Communist" alternatives may be or become much more popular among "non-conventional" Wink AFOLs with lower incomes?
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#6
I don't know what to think of this. I mean, what's the use of this? I can't think of any 'widely' used unofficial part besides the sBrick.
And the L in LDraw stands for Lego right?

What's the use of making third party parts 'official'?
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#7
Quote:I don't know what to think of this. I mean, what's the use of this? I can't think of any 'widely' used unofficial part besides the sBrick.
To name a few:
- Hitechnic and Mindsensors Mindstorms sensors and actuators
- Firgelli motorized linear actuator (Mindstorms)
- Rotacaster omniwheel
- Brickarms/Brickforge/Brickwarriors minifig accessories (and probably many other!!!)
- Big Ben train stuff

Quote:And the L in LDraw stands for Lego right?
Exactly. "for LEGO"

Quote:What's the use of making third party parts 'official'?
To get something reliable for this kind of stuff, to have one centralized placed for LDraw parts.
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#8
Dear Willy,

Thank you!
We're really happy that SBrick Plus and SBrick can become available on LDraw.
Luckily from the outside both bricks are identical, so the SBrick Plus and SBrick can only be differentiated by colour. By default, SBrick will be grey with a yellow LED. SBrick Plus will be white with a blue LED. If it's simpler for us to provide only 1 3D, let me know.

The timiing on this couldn't be better as we have just entered the 2nd week of our Kickstarter campaign for SBrick Plus. 
This annoucement will lead our weekly Backer update on Friday, where we will also invite whomever wishes to create models for SBrick Plus and SBrick to contact us at info@sbrick.com. All of these models will be created using LDraw.

Thank you again for letting us be part of the LDraw family. 
Yours,
Lenard
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#9
Hey,

this is not the first time I think about the possibility to share also non official LEGO parts via LDraw files. From my point of view there are a lot of advantages. The biggest is that you can share your models in digital form.

But in my opinion there should be a clear border; there should be only one official LEGO library.


I think that the situation can be resolved by defining a new meta command that tells the software what library was used to create a model. It is still possible to build models with only the LEGO library but it is also possible to link to third party libraries. The meta command could contain the name of the library, its version and the location where you can download it.

For example:

Code:
0 !LIBRARY Official 1502 http://www.ldraw.org/library/updates/complete1502.zip
0 !LIBRARY Unofficial 20161019133106 http://www.ldraw.org/library/unofficial/ldrawunf.zip
0 !LIBRARY SBrick 1.0 http://www.ldraw.org/library/thirdparty/sbrick_v1.0.zip
0 !LIBRARY LDD 2488 http://www.digital-bricks.de/download/primitives2488.zip

When there are parts that are not produced by LEGO but should be supported officially by LDraw it would be possible to provide an additional download location on the official LDraw web page. The parts can go through the parts tracker but will end up in a separate lib.

This is not conclusively thought through (the web pages needs to be available all the time, the download locations are not allowed to change, file naming conventions, …)! Just an idea.


Rolf
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#10
Currently working on Buwizz brick... Any suggestions for part header and for file naming?
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#11
(2017-05-20, 15:51)Philippe Hurbain Wrote: Currently working on Buwizz brick... Any suggestions for part header and for file naming?
Had a try... please have a look! http://www.ldraw.org/cgi-bin/ptdetail.cg...335c01.dat
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#12
(2017-05-21, 14:45)Philippe Hurbain Wrote:
(2017-05-20, 15:51)Philippe Hurbain Wrote: Currently working on Buwizz brick... Any suggestions for part header and for file naming?
Had a try... please have a look! http://www.ldraw.org/cgi-bin/ptdetail.cg...335c01.dat

Is this the first 3rd-party part on the tracker since this was announced?
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#13
(2017-05-22, 3:38)Travis Cobbs Wrote: Is this the first 3rd-party part on the tracker since this was announced?
AFAIK, yes...
Edit: Actually there were in the past some NXT sensors made by Hitechnic (eg. http://www.ldraw.org/cgi-bin/ptscan.cgi?q=ms1038). But they were sold by LEGO so their status was a bit different.
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#14
(2017-05-22, 4:52)Philippe Hurbain Wrote:
(2017-05-22, 3:38)Travis Cobbs Wrote: Is this the first 3rd-party part on the tracker since this was announced?
AFAIK, yes...

The Sbrick was never made an 'official' part?
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#15
(2017-05-22, 8:12)Merlijn Wissink Wrote:
(2017-05-22, 4:52)Philippe Hurbain Wrote: AFAIK, yes...

The Sbrick was never made an 'official' part?
No. I made it and it's available on Sbrick website, but not submitted to PT so far (this was not possible at the time). I'll clean it up and put on PT when everybody agrees on the way it should be done.
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#17
IMO there should be separate library(s) for this stuff in principle. But of course that would not be backwards-compatible with old tools. Sad
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#18
(2017-12-24, 9:06)Michael Horvath Wrote: IMO there should be separate library(s) for this stuff in principle. But of course that would not be backwards-compatible with old tools. Sad

The only problem I see with a separate library or folder is that the parts won't be listed by MakeList.
But a unique prefix to the part number, for example t1234.dat or tp1234, would make the files much easier to spot.
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#19
Quote:But a unique prefix to the part number, for example t1234.dat or tp1234, would make the files much easier to spot.
Yes, I too think it would be a good thing. No such parts have been released so far, so this can easily be done.
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#20
Music 
Does this mean that parts that are exclusive to other brands could be added? Like these parts from Cobi:
   
They're compatible with Lego in terms of size, and the SNOT pieces provide flexibility Lego currently doesn't have.
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#21
(2019-06-06, 4:38)Matt Chambers Wrote: Does this mean that parts that are exclusive to other brands could be added? Like these parts from Cobi:

They're compatible with Lego in terms of size, and the SNOT pieces provide flexibility Lego currently doesn't have.
Sorry, no... See https://forums.ldraw.org/thread-21841-po...l#pid23483
Now this kind of parts are very easy to model and of course nothing prevents you to add them to your own private library!
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#22
(2019-06-06, 5:35)Philippe Hurbain Wrote: Sorry, no... See https://forums.ldraw.org/thread-21841-po...l#pid23483
Now this kind of parts are very easy to model and of course nothing prevents you to add them to your own private library!


Quote:No. I made it and it's available on Sbrick website, but not submitted to PT so far (this was not possible at the time). I'll clean it up and put on PT when everybody agrees on the way it should be done.

Is there a difference between the Sbrick-exclusive parts and the Cobi-exclusive parts? Or is there no difference and that's why Sbrick still isn't in PT? Sad

If it was in a private library, can that library be passed along and loaded automatically when viewing an LDraw model?

But why use a private library for publicly available toys? Cobi was chosen by Boeing, a company that makes more profit than Lego makes revenue, to produce its toy brick planes!
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#23
(2019-06-06, 13:59)Matt Chambers Wrote: Is there a difference between the Sbrick-exclusive parts and the Cobi-exclusive parts? Or is there no difference and that's why Sbrick still isn't in PT? Sad
S-Brick IS on PT: https://www.ldraw.org/cgi-bin/ptdetail.c...032c01.dat and https://www.ldraw.org/cgi-bin/ptdetail.c...032c02.dat (BuWizz is available too: https://www.ldraw.org/cgi-bin/ptdetail.c...001c01.dat)

Quote:If it was in a private library, can that library be passed along and loaded automatically when viewing an LDraw model?
Sure. Most LDraw tools can be configured to use several different libraries.


Quote:But why use a private library for publicly available toys? Cobi was chosen by Boeing, a company that makes more profit than Lego makes revenue, to produce its toy brick planes!
I won't enter into political/philosophical discussions Wink
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#28
(2019-06-06, 13:59)Matt Chambers Wrote: If it was in a private library, can that library be passed along and loaded automatically when viewing an LDraw model?

In addition to what Philo already said, you can also use an MPD tool to embed the local custom parts into an MPD, so that if you share that MPD, everyone can see the parts as intended. This has the advantage of making it work for everybody, not just people who have installed the custom library.
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#24
(2019-06-06, 14:31)Philippe Hurbain Wrote: S-Brick IS on PT: 
Ah. Searching for sbrick found nothing. Has to be "s-brick". So why is S-Brick allowed to be "official" but Cobi isn't?
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#25
(2019-06-06, 15:04)Matt Chambers Wrote: Ah. Searching for sbrick found nothing. Has to be "s-brick". So why is S-Brick allowed to be "official" but Cobi isn't?

Anyway the ability to add custom parts and use them to build PDF instructions is enough for me (and more than I can do on competing designer systems, e.g. LDD, Stud.io, Mecabricks.com). The Cobi parts library could be shared on Google Drive for that matter. I do love the openness of this LDraw ecosystem, I just hope it eventually opens up a bit about brand loyalty.
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#26
(2019-06-06, 15:04)Matt Chambers Wrote: Ah. Searching for sbrick found nothing. Has to be "s-brick". So why is S-Brick allowed to be "official" but Cobi isn't?

From my perspective the reason is because S-Brick is explicitly made to be used as a supplement for LEGO as opposed to Cobi which is a clone brick brand competing against LEGO. I’m sure you could find some sort of counter argument but at the end of the day it’s on the judgment of Chris Dee, the Library Admin.
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RE: LDraw.org allows third party part in the LDraw Parts Library
#27
(2019-06-06, 16:47)Orion Pobursky Wrote: From my perspective the reason is because S-Brick is explicitly made to be used as a supplement for LEGO as opposed to Cobi which is a clone brick brand competing against LEGO. I’m sure you could find some sort of counter argument but at the end of the day it’s on the judgment of Chris Dee, the Library Admin.

Doesn't S-Brick compete against LEGO's remote control solutions? Smile How do Cobi's studs-on-top-and-bottom bricks compete against LEGO, which has no such bricks?

Perhaps the distinction is that S-Brick competes against LEGO in a very limited way whereas Cobi competes in a quite broad way (they produce many of the same brick shapes, only a few exclusive ones). But I'm only suggesting for (currently) exclusive bricks to be added (it would be silly to duplicate parts for each clone brand when they are meant to be interchangeable).
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