[LDView] LDview will not start (previously worked)

[Leonardo Gonzalez]

For reasons unknown, when I try to open the LDView.exe it only shows on the task manager for 2 seconds and then disappears. It was working before (about a week ago), I had everything setup to run LDCad, convert with LDView, and render in POV-Ray.

LDCad and POV-Ray work just fine, but LDView suddenly stopped operating. I have tried everything I know, including but not limited to cleanups, scans, check disk, defrag, etc. And went on and did a clean installation of the LDraw AIOI.

After re-installing the AIOI, LDView is still not working. Any ideas on troubleshooting? Everything is updated to the latest (stable) version in the PC (I avoid betas).


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Update:

• The effect appears to only be caused by AMD drivers, I will keep track of this for the next updates.
  
• You can immediately gain back the use of LDView by uninstalling the Radeon Software (in this specific case, meaning if you updated to anything after 20.12.1).
  
• If you would like to have access to the video card functionality with the previous version of the software, you can download it on the official AMD website by clicking this link and scrolling down to the installation package: Radeon Software version 20.12.1
  
• In the very rare event that the uninstall fails, AMD provides a cleanup tool that you can run to remove traces of the Radeon Software. Follow this link for the AMD Cleanup Utility.
  

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Tested updates that break LDView 4.3 functionality:

• Radeon Software version: 21.2.1 (Optional update released: 2/1/2021)
  
• Radeon Software version: 21.3.1 (Recommended update released: 3/10/2021)
  
• Radeon Software version: 21.4.1 (considered a Recommended update released: 4/13/2021) 1
  

- Optional update: This means that the update does not contain critical fixes from AMD, rather some minor specific changes. If these changes do not affect the use of your video card you can skip the optional update (if you haven't installed it yet) until the next recommended update is available.

- Recommended update: This is a standard stable driver update that AMD recommends to all users of their cards. Recommended updates often include new features and fixes.

1 Also tested with LDView 4.4 Beta 4 test release.

[Travis Cobbs]

For reasons unknown, when I try to open the LDView.exe it only shows on the task manager for 2 seconds and then disappears. It was working before (about a week ago), I had everything setup to run LDCad, convert with LDView, and render in POV-Ray.

LDCad and POV-Ray work just fine, but LDView suddenly stopped operating. I have tried everything I know, including but not limited to cleanups, scans, check disk, defrag, etc. And went on and did a clean installation of the LDraw AIOI.

After re-installing the AIOI, LDView is still not working. Any ideas on troubleshooting?  Everything is updated to the latest (stable) version in the PC (I avoid betas).

I have no idea, but you might try uninstalling the LDView you got from the AIOI and installing the latest official 64-bit LDView release standalone.

[Leonardo Gonzalez]

I have no idea, but you might try uninstalling the LDView you got from the AIOI and installing the latest official 64-bit LDView release standalone.

I did what you suggested, but the behavior remains the same. Later found out that both versions work fine in Safe Mode so, I'm in the process of selectively killing processes and services to see what is messing with the program start. So far it appears to be a memory access issue of some sort. But as you probably know, in Windows everything is a "maybe".

I'll update at a later time with my findings.

[Gerald Lasser]

.... Later found out that both versions work fine in Safe Mode so, ...

Is this a virtual machine or HW?

[Leonardo Gonzalez]

Is this a virtual machine or HW?

This is a standard Windows 10 Pro machine, my daily use home PC.

[Leonardo Gonzalez]

I was unable to find the cause of the problem. In the interest of not wasting time I decided to install a backup that I had made recently. It is all back to normal now.

However, I will keep an eye to see if it happens again and if I can catch whatever created the problem. I found at least one other (not related) program misbehaving, which tells me that something was going on within Windows.

[Sebastian]

Same Problem here.
@Leonardo Gonzales what kind of Graphic Card are you using? I have a AMD RX5700XT, also on Win10 Pro with all Updates

[Leonardo Gonzalez]

Same Problem here.
@Leonardo Gonzales what kind of Graphic Card are you using? I have a AMD RX5700XT, also on Win10 Pro with all Updates

My current setup is:
OS: Windows 10 Pro version 20H2 (OS Build 19042.746)
CPU: Intel Core i7-3770 3.40GHz
GPU: Asus Strix Radeon RX 590
Radeon Software version: 20.12.1
RAM: 16 GB

I've been holding on updating the Radeon Software and slowly applying the changes I made before to the computer in order to find if something I did affected the LDView.

What Radeon Software version do you have?

[Sebastian]

My current setup is:
OS: Windows 10 Pro version 20H2 (OS Build 19042.746)
CPU: Intel Core i7-3770 3.40GHz
GPU: Asus Strix Radeon RX 590
Radeon Software version: 20.12.1
RAM: 16 GB

I've been holding on updating the Radeon Software and slowly applying the changes I made before to the computer in order to find if something I did affected the LDView.

What Radeon Software version do you have?

latest: 21.2.1

[Leonardo Gonzalez]

latest: 21.2.1

I tested LDView using the Radeon Software version: 20.12.1 and it works as expected. Then without making any other changes, updated the Radeon Software and upon restarting after completing the installation LDView no longer works.

I can confirm, without a doubt, that the Radeon Software version: 21.2.1 breaks LDView 4.3 (in both 32-bit and 64-bit).

[Travis Cobbs]

I tested LDView using the Radeon Software version: 20.12.1 and it works as expected. Then without making any other changes, updated the Radeon Software and upon restarting after completing the installation LDView no longer works.

I can confirm, without a doubt, that the Radeon Software version: 21.2.1 breaks LDView 4.3 (in both 32-bit and 64-bit).

Thank you for tracking that down.

This is very unfortunate. LDView uses truly ancient OpenGL functionality, that probably doesn't get used by any modern 3D apps. As such, AMD might not even know that they introduced a bug. And I have no way to reproduce the issue, since I don't have any Radeon graphics cards available to me.

[Orion Pobursky]

I tested LDView using the Radeon Software version: 20.12.1 and it works as expected. Then without making any other changes, updated the Radeon Software and upon restarting after completing the installation LDView no longer works.

I can confirm, without a doubt, that the Radeon Software version: 21.2.1 breaks LDView 4.3 (in both 32-bit and 64-bit).

I have a Ryzen with integrated VEGA graphics system I can use to test.

[Leonardo Gonzalez]

After further looking into it, I have found this:

- Radeon Software version: 21.2.1 is an "optional" update and not a "recommended" one. This means that it does not contain critical updates (or must have) from AMD, rather some minor specific changes. If these changes do not affect the use of your video card you can skip the optional update (if you haven't installed it yet) until the next recommended update is available. Hopefully with better results.

- You can immediately gain back the use of LDView by uninstalling the Radeon Software (in this specific case, meaning if you updated to 21.2.1).

- If you would like to have access to the video card functionality with the previous version of the software (without the optional update stuff) you can download it on the official AMD website by clicking this link and scrolling down to the installation package: Radeon Software version 20.12.1

- In the very rare event that the uninstall fails, AMD provides a cleanup tool that you can run to remove traces of the Radeon Software. Follow this link for the AMD Cleanup Utility.

I will keep track of this for the next update and maybe submit a bug report to AMD with their own report tool.

[Leonardo Gonzalez]

An update on the software situation with the LDView 4.3

Radeon Software version: 21.3.1 (considered a Recommended update released: 3/10/2021) continues to breaks LDView 4.3.

[Leonardo Gonzalez]

Radeon Software version: 21.4.1 (considered a Recommended update released: 4/13/2021) continues to breaks LDView 4.3. Also failed with LDView 4.4 Beta 4 test release.

[Travis Cobbs]

Radeon Software version: 21.4.1 (considered a Recommended update released: 4/13/2021) continues to breaks LDView 4.3. Also failed with LDView 4.4 Beta 4 test release.

Unfortunately, unless you (or someone else with a Radeon card that's not working) is willing to build LDView from source and run it in a debugger, this is not likely to ever be fixed. You could try reporting it to AMD.

As an aside, you might try running with -IgnoreAllOGLExtensions=1 on the command line. If this fixes the problem, you can then try disabling each of the supported extensions one by one. The individual Ignore settings are:

1. IgnoreAniso
   
2. IgnoreFramebufferObject
   
3. IgnoreMultiDrawArrays
   
4. IgnoreMultisample
   
5. IgnoreMultisampleFilterHint
   
6. IgnorePBuffer
   
7. IgnorePixelFormat
   
8. IgnoreVAR
   
9. IgnoreVBO
   

[Leonardo Gonzalez]

I did submit a report to AMD, I doubt that will result in any help from them.

I was forced to remove the Radeon Software version: 21.4.1 because it was causing constant intermittent crashes on my card (I counted 11 in about 30 seconds). Nonetheless, I will definitely try your suggestions. I'm not sure about the compiling part, but I can certainly test the program with the extensions off. Will report back on my findings.

[Leonardo Gonzalez]

I was able to do some testing before my computer crashed (due to the drivers). I went through the whole list, but only one command works to get the program working.

The -IgnoreMultisample=1 command line allows LDView to work in the newer Radeon drivers.

[Travis Cobbs]

I was able to do some testing before my computer crashed (due to the drivers). I went through the whole list, but only one command works to get the program working.

The -IgnoreMultisample=1 command line allows LDView to work in the newer Radeon drivers.

That's certainly good news. Out of curiosity, did you have FSAA enabled in LDView? If so, could you try disabling it, and then see if it will run without that setting? I can look at the code that gets enabled by that setting, but I'm still doubtful that I'll be able to fix it.

[Leonardo Gonzalez]

That's certainly good news. Out of curiosity, did you have FSAA enabled in LDView? If so, could you try disabling it, and then see if it will run without that setting? I can look at the code that gets enabled by that setting, but I'm still doubtful that I'll be able to fix it.

Apologies for the extremely long delay.

Yes, if I set the FSAA to off, then update the drivers, and open LDView, the program is able to run.