+- LDraw.org Discussion Forums (https://forums.ldraw.org)
+-- Forum: LDraw Programs (https://forums.ldraw.org/forum-7.html)
+--- Forum: LDraw Editors and Viewers (https://forums.ldraw.org/forum-11.html)
+--- Thread: LPub3D - rotstep (/thread-20446.html)
LPub3D - rotstep - Jetro de Château - 2016-02-08
One of the hardest things to achieve is getting the perfect angle for a specific step. I normally use the standard angle, but sometimes you need to change it to show where a specific piece is attached...
I'm familiar with the use of the ROTSTEP command, both relative (which I use most) and absolute), but I was wondring if there were some better way to find the right angle than guessing the numbers.
When I used MLCad I used the preview window for the ROTSTEP command, but I haven't found anything similar in MLCad (yet). Since LPub3D also has a 3D view pane (which I haven't found a use for yet) I was wondering if that could be used to determine the correct numbers for a specific ROTSTEP command.
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Jaco van der Molen - 2016-02-08
Can't help you much there Jetro. I do what you do too: guess and see in the visual preview of MLCad what it looks like.
What I do do however is always round the numbers to whole numbers mostly multiple of 5.
So if the MLCad rotation preview gives coordinates like x 48,5362457 and y 23,3425676 I set the values to 50 and 25.
Then I try 45 and 20 and/or 55 and 30 for example to see if it gets any better.
I still cannot comprehend what relative and absolute means so I always mess around a bit and see where it goes.
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Jetro de Château - 2016-02-08
More or less what I do. I'm trying to find a way to not use MLCad any more though. LDCad is so much nicer
As for REL vs ABS, I usually use REL when I know more or less how much I want to rotate a model from its default position. ABS starts from 0 and is the absolute position of the model, which for me comes in handy when I want a 2D view of the model in some step (e.g. a top view) in which case the number are always 0, 90 or 180.
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Roland Melkert - 2016-02-08
Jetro de Château Wrote:More or less what I do. I'm trying to find a way to not use MLCad any more though. LDCad is so much nicerLDCad 1.6 will have support for rotstep including setting/viewing the angle.
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Jaco van der Molen - 2016-02-08
Jetro de Château Wrote:More or less what I do. I'm trying to find a way to not use MLCad any more though. LDCad is so much nicer
I just recently really dove into LDCad and must say I agree!
Jetro de Château Wrote:As for REL vs ABS, I usually use REL when I know more or less how much I want to rotate a model from its default position. ABS starts from 0 and is the absolute position of the model, which for me comes in handy when I want a 2D view of the model in some step (e.g. a top view) in which case the number are always 0, 90 or 180.
Ah, I see. But what I always find lacking for exact top view are the lines between the bricks.
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Jaco van der Molen - 2016-02-08
Will it have some standard values Roland?
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Jetro de Château - 2016-02-08
I imagine there must be some setting that can be changed to make that happen... in the same way I imagine there must be some way to show the LEGO logo on the studs. I seem to remember it was possible to do that in LDview (couldn't get it to work right now)
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Jaco van der Molen - 2016-02-08
Jetro de Château Wrote:I imagine there must be some setting that can be changed to make that happen... in the same way I imagine there must be some way to show the LEGO logo on the studs. I seem to remember it was possible to do that in LDview (couldn't get it to work right now)Lines always black perhaps?
What I do now is set the value for the abs rotstep to 89.5 instead of 90. Then some lines show, but still not perfect.
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Roland Melkert - 2016-02-08
The way I'm thinking of implementing is by adding an option "Togle ROTSTEP" to the step menu. With it you can convert a normal step meta, added before, to a ROTSTEP one or a ROTSTEP one back to a nomal one.
If you change a normal step into a ROTSTEP a dialog will ask to apply the current editing view as its abs/rel orientation. Afterwards you can change the rotation through some normal menu item click.
This is my initial idea about it though, I usually get my best ideas while working on a first 'try'
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Brendan Mauro - 2016-02-08
Hmm...so Roland, when I discussed this with you via email, I remember bringing up that LDCad doesn't recognize a ROTSTEP as a separate step, which it sounds like you are addressing with this? I mention it because since then I've noticed Lpub3D seems to follow the same logic, ROTSTEPs are only used to set orientation but require a STEP to be paired with to be read as a separate step. MLCad is the one that treats ROTSTEPs and STEPs as steps.
If I had to vote for which program to match, I would say Lpub3D all the way - but maybe this needs to be discussed with Trevor to ensure some consistency.
Edit: I _really_ like the idea that it just sets it based on whatever your current camera position is - very efficient! Maybe make a right-click option on a ROTSTEP in the source view to set the camera back to that position if you need to go back and check?
Edit 2: I realized my error! (see below) Lpub recognizes ROTSTEPs as STEPs. Apologies for causing so much confusion.
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Roland Melkert - 2016-02-08
Brendan Mauro Wrote:If I had to vote for which program to match, I would say Lpub3D all the way - but maybe this needs to be discussed with Trevor to ensure some consistency.The rotstep meta is a lglite/mlcad step meta extension, so I figured it needs to act like a normal step but with camera control.
This document seems to agree with this (chapter 6)
http://lm-software.com/mlcad/Specification_V2.0.pdf
So technically this could be a LPub bug? Or maybe it's such an old issue it became the new behavior? Is there more software using it as a info meta only?
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Jetro de Château - 2016-02-08
I rather like the fact that LPub doesn't treat it like a step. It makes it easier to see where the steps are in e.g. the source window.
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Brendan Mauro - 2016-02-08
Roland Melkert Wrote:Brendan Mauro Wrote:If I had to vote for which program to match, I would say Lpub3D all the way - but maybe this needs to be discussed with Trevor to ensure some consistency.The rotstep meta is a lglite/mlcad step meta extension, so I figured it needs to act like a normal step but with camera control.
This document seems to agree with this (chapter 6)
http://lm-software.com/mlcad/Specification_V2.0.pdf
So technically this could be a LPub bug? Or maybe it's such an old issue it became the new behavior? Is there more software using it as a info meta only?
Whoops, I spoke too soon. LPub does recognize a ROTSTEP as a step. What I was seeing was LPub being smart and recognizing that multiple STEPs or ROTSTEPs with no parts between them as null and not printing blank steps as a result. So a STEP followed by some metadata and a ROTSTEP is still considered one step.
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Trevor Sandy - 2016-02-09
In fact, LPub3D treats it like a step also. However, if nothing is inserted between the ROTSTEP meta and the next STEP meta then there is nothing for LPub3D to do - no automatic blank page is displayed.
I thought about replacing the STEP meta when ROTSTEP is inserted but I opted to keep the functionality as it was in LPub4 to maintain compatibility.
Cheers,
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Jaco van der Molen - 2016-02-09
Please keep ROTSTEPS recognized as STEPS in LPub3D?
If we would change this now, many files won't be backwards compatible anymore!
Re: LPub3D - rotstep - Roland Melkert - 2016-02-09
Trevor Sandy Wrote:In fact, LPub3D treats it like a step also. However, if nothing is inserted between the ROTSTEP meta and the next STEP meta then there is nothing for LPub3D to do - no automatic blank page is displayed.That's logical no reason to include blank steps/pages